Reconsidering this chapter > We Are Smarter Than Me

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Subject: Reconsidering this chapter

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joe_flum
Posts:151

11/12/2006 12:32 AM	Alert
In looking through the idea for this chapter, it appears to be extremely similar to Chapter 4 : We Can Market It. Both chapters deal with the "selling" issue. What is marketing if not a method for generating sales? I don't know what you guys think, but I think this chapter should be merged with marketing so as not to detract and confuse the situation. What do you guys think? Please share your comments. cheers, joe

abhazard
Posts:3

11/15/2006 8:08 PM	Alert
Joe, This same suggestion was brought up by our editorial staff, but we've decided to leave it in. The reasoning is this. Businesses have Sales units and Marketing units that are quite distinct. We hope to define how comunity will impact both of these business functions. I suspect that the way Sales professionals view community will be quite different from the way marketing folks do. Isaac

joe_flum
Posts:151

11/15/2006 9:43 PM	Alert
Ok, then I believe it will be important to try to make a clear distinction between the two. How exactly is sales different from marketing?

1ofus
Posts:103

11/17/2006 10:31 AM	Alert
I think that this conversation speaks clearly to th focus and structure I hve proposed for the rearrangement of the book. It that case, both chapters being in Part I deal with 'as is' organisations where the community approach nevertheless made big difference. IT is only later in the book that I suggest we will find examples of organisations where the functional splits are collapsed and where th community approach allows not just for innovation but for quantum leaps - even creating new markets like eBay!

iphazard
Posts:87

11/17/2006 11:09 AM	Alert
Joe, The main difference is this: Marketing is about getting a message out. Sales is about closing a transaction. The ways that community can impact each are varied and distinct. There is certainly come overlap between the 2, but I think the differences outweigh the similarities. FYI, the reason there is not real seed content in the Sales Chapter is that the folks who wrote the bulk of hte seed content had the same concern that you do. But the Advisory board was adamant that the 2 were separate. And I concur. Isaac

iphazard
Posts:87

11/17/2006 11:11 AM	Alert
Lilly, I'm a bit overwhelmed with the activity on these boards right now. So many good ideas and suggestions. I'm hoping to aggregate the issues into a big list which I can post to the wiki to stimulate further thought. Your proposal for the new chapter structure is good. I plan to put some distilled version along with a link to your post in the "Proposed Table Of Contents wiki page. Isaac

joe_flum
Posts:151

11/17/2006 12:01 PM	Alert
Isaac, I second the overwhelmed thought. After a couple of weeks of relatively minor discussions, we've kind of exploded into a flurry of ideas. As a starting point, I think we really need to organize the roles and responsabilities (check the thread for a proposal). I see it as part of the researcher's "job", to mine the forums for ideas and themes that can work into the book. The amount of ideas is only going to grow, so we need to make sure we enlist the help of as many people as possible to fill that roles that the project requires. cheers, joe

1ofus
Posts:103

11/24/2006 7:22 PM	Alert
It is a week since the last two posts. I realise this is in the middle of biggest US holiday. Can we move on this asap in the next week?

joe_flum
Posts:151

11/25/2006 1:32 PM	Alert
I'm hoping that my work cluster program will help us identify people and acheive the networking necessary to get the group working like a team. I definately want to be showing you guys things by mid next week.

sbailey
Posts:2

11/29/2006 1:01 PM	Alert
I am really quite new to all of this in as much as I was never formally schooled in business or marketing. I simply see things from the point of view of the consumer as well as one who deals with customer relations. I may sound simple minded in any of my opinions but here at Shopzilla, we see how the community has an impact on the way merchants deal with their customer which affects the bottom line, which is the sale. I believe that the community dictates how the merchant is perceived, which, no matter how pretty they are packaged, has a bearing on whether or not they will make a sale.

melaclaro
Posts:17

11/29/2006 3:02 PM	Alert
Hi Stephany (sbailey), I think what you just mentioned would be a great a case study to write into the book. I'm just brainstorming here, but... ...You might start by either creating a sub-header under, say, "2.2 The role of sales in modern business". Or create a new header entirely like: "2.5 - Case Studies." You could then add your case study as the first subheader with a title like: "Case Study: Shopzilla's Consumers Impact on Merchant Behavior." The case study might start with a soup-to-nuts description of how a typical consumer would approach buying, say a digital camera, from the site. You might follow a fictitious person's experience (say, "John") from the home page, through making feature comparisons, pricing comparisons, and geographic comparisons (all features that I noted are available to the consumer on Shopzilla). Then, you might describe how "John's" product selections might be influenced by customer ratings and customer reviews (also site features) -- or the lack of them -- on each of the products he chooses to select. Continue with describing "John's" progression from comparison to purchase. Then from purchase to receipt of merchandise and usability. You might also surmise John's post-sale experience and how that might compel him to make a customer review... You could end the case study with a summary describing your perspective of how "John's" behavior, when magnified by 1000s, subsequently compels changes in merchant behavior... or Shopzilla's behavior for that matter. (For example, are there situations in which Shopzilla will "de-list" a merchant? That could be yet another case study.) Don't worry about intro and transition from/to previous sections. I'm sure someone else will find the gumption to fill those pieces in. In any case, I think your views would make an appropriate case study that I think we sorely need more of throughout the book. -- Mel

gkrauska
Posts:1

12/22/2006 9:48 AM	Alert
I believe Sales and Marketing should be distinct chapters. If we break down the sequence between "Marketing" and "Sales" into a few more parts, there is clearer separation, as well as some overlap. The full sequence could be seen as: AWARE (somehow, I as a customer decide I have a need and become aware of options), INTEREST (Considering options, I narrow my choices and explore further) INVOLVED ( I decide to actively engage the seller, determine fit, assess against my buying criteria) BUY (I complete a transaction and arrange to take delivery, implement, etc.) Marketing is traditionally responsible for the first two; sales the latter. There are many cases where there is overlap. It also helps to look at the parallel activities that sales and marketing are engaged in - (From Business Week Online Dec 16, 2005) "First you help prospects understand the problem you solve, then you explain the solution you provide, next you establish your credibility, and later you motivate them to contact you, etc. Step by step, you move them closer to a sale." The intersection of seller and buyer - and the handoffs between marketing and sales create a fascinating dynamic to explore - especially as we begin to draw the comparison from traditional marketing and sales (2.2, as referenced by Mel above and 2.x, whatever that new dynamic looks like. As noted above, the community forms its own perceptions over time. As I think about it, we may also want to explore B2B vs B2C distinctions, as I can see where there can be some unique characteristics of each, again, with significant overlap. Greg Greg

jm04469
Posts:18

12/28/2006 12:27 PM	Alert
Can we agree that if the publisher wanted to give away this book 100% free (in terms of price) that no selling would occur but the need for marketing still exists?

1ofus
Posts:103

12/28/2006 9:02 PM	Alert
For my money (sic) the 'selling' here relates to both the subject (community) and the object (whatever this community creates for the use in the world). The book itself is such an example. Now, marketing need is only necessary if we think that is how the end endevour will be best placed into the world at large. If I feel strongly about something and talk about it to my friends, I do not consider it marketing. Yet, it spredas the word. Or, to put it another way, one of our challenges is to grapple throughout the book with the paradox that while 'We Are Smarter Than Me' implies novel and potentially fundamentally different ways of operating, such entities operate in the main as embeded structures in conventiaonally organised corporations. So, the challenge is to keep the two going and yet not get too tied up to the 'what is' as the only option.